[Ipg-smz] New Job Question: Trial Period to Full Time Staffer

Fri Nov 1 16:27:44 UTC 2019

Re writers with teeth:  Well said.

Ask me about the time Informa hired me away from a then-thriving freelance
business only to have a layoff five months later.  I found out by suddenly
not having remote email access when I got off a plane.  Nice.

Ellen Muraskin

High-Tech Stories in Low-Tech Prose

ellen.muraskin at gmail.com <efm2 at optonline.net>

973-734-1972

973-479-7598 (m)

https://www.linkedin.com/in/ellenmuraskin

https://ellenmuraskin.contently.com/ (for marcomm work)

https://www.clippings.me/efm2 (for straight trade journalism)

On Thu, Oct 31, 2019 at 12:23 PM Liam Kelly via Ipg-smz <
ipg-smz at netpress.org> wrote:

> Thanks all for the suggestions.
>
> Looks like I'll take a firmer stance (Beyonce/Fuck 'em position) despite
> how attractive the full time position appears.
>
> Writers with teeth certainly eat better than those without.
>
>
>
> On Thu, Oct 31, 2019, 16:55 Todd R. Weiss via Ipg-smz <
> ipg-smz at netpress.org> wrote:
>
>> I'm with Joe.
>> When they finally hire you and you know it is going to work out for YOU,
>> that's when you can stop writing for others.
>> Unless these guys want to pay you what you would have made in a month to
>> make up for your lost revenue, why should you lose the revenue?
>> If they don't know your work and your writing now, what's a month with no
>> freelance work going to tell them?
>> After several layoffs over the years, sometimes one just has to look out
>> for one's self.
>> No one else appears to be looking out for any of us nowadays.
>>
>> Good luck, man.
>>
>> Todd :)
>>
>> Todd R. Weiss
>>
>> Technology Journalist
>>
>>
>> Contributor:
>>
>> www.ChannelFutures.com <http://www.channelfutures.com/>
>>
>> www.ChannelPartnersOnline.com
>>
>> www.eWEEK.com
>>
>>
>>
>> *Formerly with eWEEK.com and Computerworld.com*
>>
>> TechManTalking
>>
>> 717-806-5932 office
>> 717-413-9630 cell
>>
>> toddrweiss at gmail.com
>>
>>
>> Twitter: https://twitter.com/TechManTalking
>> LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/toddrweiss/
>>
>> Google+ https://plus.google.com/u/0/+ToddRWeiss
>>
>> Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/TechManTalking/
>>
>> Member, Internet Press Guild
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Oct 31, 2019 at 11:47 AM Joe Stanganelli via Ipg-smz <
>> ipg-smz at netpress.org> wrote:
>>
>>> It sounds like you’ve answered your own question. You’re being asked to
>>> take enormous risk.
>>>
>>> Absent some form of legal agreement (whether in the form of an official
>>> contract, or in the form of some email back and forth indicating such an
>>> agreement or that your trial period is expressly contingent on such an
>>> agreement), what the trial-period folks don’t know can’t hurt ‘em.
>>>
>>> And, from a beyond-legal standpoint: If you “violate” this editor’s
>>> expectations and continue writing willy-nilly for all your other clients
>>> while still engaging in the “trial period”, what’s the worst that they are
>>> going to do to you? What are their enumerable damages? Are they going to
>>> sue you or send you a bill? What will their claim be? These are real
>>> questions to consider. And if the answer is “They’re not gonna do
>>> jackshit”, then that kind of answers the bigger question, now, don’t it?
>>>
>>> The “trial period” nonsense has long been a way for writing clients to
>>> screw over freelance writers in varying shapes and forms. It seems like you
>>> have little incentive to abide by the requested forbearance.
>>>
>>>
>>> tl;dr: Fuck ‘em.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Joe
>>>
>>>
>>> ------------------------------
>>> *From:* Ipg-smz <ipg-smz-bounces at netpress.org> on behalf of Liam Kelly
>>> via Ipg-smz <ipg-smz at netpress.org>
>>> *Sent:* Thursday, October 31, 2019 11:13:37 AM
>>> *To:* ipg-smz at netpress.org <ipg-smz at netpress.org>
>>> *Cc:* Liam Kelly <ljkelly1888 at gmail.com>
>>> *Subject:* Re: [Ipg-smz] New Job Question: Trial Period to Full Time
>>> Staffer
>>>
>>> It would be tricky. I doubt that I would still have a job there after a
>>> month of not working.
>>>
>>> I'm just imagining the situation in which I tell the vendors that I
>>> can't work there anymore because conflict-of-interest stuff, and then a
>>> month later come back looking for my old job.
>>>
>>> On Thu, Oct 31, 2019, 16:08 Sharon Fisher via Ipg-smz <
>>> ipg-smz at netpress.org> wrote:
>>>
>>> Can you compromise? Can you agree to not write for vendors during the
>>> trial period?
>>>
>>> On Thu, Oct 31, 2019, 8:59 AM Liam Kelly via Ipg-smz <
>>> ipg-smz at netpress.org> wrote:
>>>
>>> Ah yes, how could I forget!
>>>
>>> On Thu, Oct 31, 2019 at 3:55 PM Mitch Wagner <mitch at mitchwagner.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> Seems to me that Beyonce has the best advice here:
>>>
>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4m1EFMoRFvY
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>>
>>> Mitch Wagner <http://mitchwagner.com/about/>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thu, Oct 31, 2019 at 7:42 AM Joe Stanganelli via Ipg-smz <
>>> ipg-smz at netpress.org> wrote:
>>>
>>> (IAAL, but this is NOT legal advice. This is “If I was in this
>>> situation, here’s what I would do.” I am not your lawyer; you are not my
>>> client. I owe you no duties and I am not to be trusted.)
>>>
>>> If the editor has merely said “stop writing for these other pubs” but
>>> there is not an actual agreement to stop writing for these pubs, fuck ‘em.
>>> Say nothing and write for whomever you want. You are still freelance.
>>>
>>> If they are asking you to agree to stop writing for other pubs, tell
>>> them to go fuck themselves because that’s not how the world works.
>>>
>>> And, either way, I’d be seriously suspicious of doing any business with
>>> these fuckwads moving forward.
>>>
>>> I am in a similar situation with a long-time client whose new-ish editor
>>> has expressed the expectation that I tell him if I’m writing for other
>>> security sites and that I’m not supposed to. I said nothing because I was
>>> so stunned to hear such bullshit. And I write for whomever I want.
>>>
>>> tl;dr: Fuck these fucks.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Joe
>>>
>>>
>>> ------------------------------
>>> *From:* Ipg-smz <ipg-smz-bounces at netpress.org> on behalf of Liam Kelly
>>> via Ipg-smz <ipg-smz at netpress.org>
>>> *Sent:* Thursday, October 31, 2019 10:12:01 AM
>>> *To:* ipg-smz at netpress.org <ipg-smz at netpress.org>
>>> *Cc:* Liam Kelly <ljkelly1888 at gmail.com>
>>> *Subject:* [Ipg-smz] New Job Question: Trial Period to Full Time Staffer
>>>
>>> Hi all,
>>>
>>> I've been speaking with a crypto/blockchain publication this week about
>>> coming on board to help with their coverage. I will be paid on a per
>>> article basis during a one month "trial period," after which, if all goes
>>> well, I'll be offered a full-time position.
>>>
>>> Now, I also write copy for some crypto/blockchain companies at current.
>>> One company is a startup in the space, whereas the other is a PR firm that
>>> represents other crypto companies (among other subjects).
>>>
>>> The editor has stated that I need to stop writing for these companies
>>> before beginning the trial period. I understand his reasoning (i.e.
>>> conflict of interest), but it seems risky.
>>>
>>> What happens if I cut ties with a chunk of high paying work only to see
>>> the full-time staff position get passed on to someone else? I should add
>>> that the staff position will likely make up for the loss of marketing work
>>> financially, and I have no problem dropping the latter once I've signed a
>>> contract to work full-time for this publication.
>>>
>>> It is indeed tricky, and I thought members of the group would have some
>>> good ideas/counter-proposals. What's a win-win for all parties in this
>>> situation?
>>>
>>> Thanks in advance,
>>>
>>> Liam
>>>
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