[Ipg-smz] New Job Question: Trial Period to Full Time Staffer

Thu Oct 31 16:21:46 UTC 2019

Thanks all for the suggestions.

Looks like I'll take a firmer stance (Beyonce/Fuck 'em position) despite
how attractive the full time position appears.

Writers with teeth certainly eat better than those without.

On Thu, Oct 31, 2019, 16:55 Todd R. Weiss via Ipg-smz <ipg-smz at netpress.org>
wrote:

> I'm with Joe.
> When they finally hire you and you know it is going to work out for YOU,
> that's when you can stop writing for others.
> Unless these guys want to pay you what you would have made in a month to
> make up for your lost revenue, why should you lose the revenue?
> If they don't know your work and your writing now, what's a month with no
> freelance work going to tell them?
> After several layoffs over the years, sometimes one just has to look out
> for one's self.
> No one else appears to be looking out for any of us nowadays.
>
> Good luck, man.
>
> Todd :)
>
> Todd R. Weiss
>
> Technology Journalist
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> On Thu, Oct 31, 2019 at 11:47 AM Joe Stanganelli via Ipg-smz <
> ipg-smz at netpress.org> wrote:
>
>> It sounds like you’ve answered your own question. You’re being asked to
>> take enormous risk.
>>
>> Absent some form of legal agreement (whether in the form of an official
>> contract, or in the form of some email back and forth indicating such an
>> agreement or that your trial period is expressly contingent on such an
>> agreement), what the trial-period folks don’t know can’t hurt ‘em.
>>
>> And, from a beyond-legal standpoint: If you “violate” this editor’s
>> expectations and continue writing willy-nilly for all your other clients
>> while still engaging in the “trial period”, what’s the worst that they are
>> going to do to you? What are their enumerable damages? Are they going to
>> sue you or send you a bill? What will their claim be? These are real
>> questions to consider. And if the answer is “They’re not gonna do
>> jackshit”, then that kind of answers the bigger question, now, don’t it?
>>
>> The “trial period” nonsense has long been a way for writing clients to
>> screw over freelance writers in varying shapes and forms. It seems like you
>> have little incentive to abide by the requested forbearance.
>>
>>
>> tl;dr: Fuck ‘em.
>>
>>
>>
>> Joe
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>> *From:* Ipg-smz <ipg-smz-bounces at netpress.org> on behalf of Liam Kelly
>> via Ipg-smz <ipg-smz at netpress.org>
>> *Sent:* Thursday, October 31, 2019 11:13:37 AM
>> *To:* ipg-smz at netpress.org <ipg-smz at netpress.org>
>> *Cc:* Liam Kelly <ljkelly1888 at gmail.com>
>> *Subject:* Re: [Ipg-smz] New Job Question: Trial Period to Full Time
>> Staffer
>>
>> It would be tricky. I doubt that I would still have a job there after a
>> month of not working.
>>
>> I'm just imagining the situation in which I tell the vendors that I can't
>> work there anymore because conflict-of-interest stuff, and then a month
>> later come back looking for my old job.
>>
>> On Thu, Oct 31, 2019, 16:08 Sharon Fisher via Ipg-smz <
>> ipg-smz at netpress.org> wrote:
>>
>> Can you compromise? Can you agree to not write for vendors during the
>> trial period?
>>
>> On Thu, Oct 31, 2019, 8:59 AM Liam Kelly via Ipg-smz <
>> ipg-smz at netpress.org> wrote:
>>
>> Ah yes, how could I forget!
>>
>> On Thu, Oct 31, 2019 at 3:55 PM Mitch Wagner <mitch at mitchwagner.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Seems to me that Beyonce has the best advice here:
>>
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4m1EFMoRFvY
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> Mitch Wagner <http://mitchwagner.com/about/>
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Oct 31, 2019 at 7:42 AM Joe Stanganelli via Ipg-smz <
>> ipg-smz at netpress.org> wrote:
>>
>> (IAAL, but this is NOT legal advice. This is “If I was in this situation,
>> here’s what I would do.” I am not your lawyer; you are not my client. I owe
>> you no duties and I am not to be trusted.)
>>
>> If the editor has merely said “stop writing for these other pubs” but
>> there is not an actual agreement to stop writing for these pubs, fuck ‘em.
>> Say nothing and write for whomever you want. You are still freelance.
>>
>> If they are asking you to agree to stop writing for other pubs, tell them
>> to go fuck themselves because that’s not how the world works.
>>
>> And, either way, I’d be seriously suspicious of doing any business with
>> these fuckwads moving forward.
>>
>> I am in a similar situation with a long-time client whose new-ish editor
>> has expressed the expectation that I tell him if I’m writing for other
>> security sites and that I’m not supposed to. I said nothing because I was
>> so stunned to hear such bullshit. And I write for whomever I want.
>>
>> tl;dr: Fuck these fucks.
>>
>>
>>
>> Joe
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>> *From:* Ipg-smz <ipg-smz-bounces at netpress.org> on behalf of Liam Kelly
>> via Ipg-smz <ipg-smz at netpress.org>
>> *Sent:* Thursday, October 31, 2019 10:12:01 AM
>> *To:* ipg-smz at netpress.org <ipg-smz at netpress.org>
>> *Cc:* Liam Kelly <ljkelly1888 at gmail.com>
>> *Subject:* [Ipg-smz] New Job Question: Trial Period to Full Time Staffer
>>
>> Hi all,
>>
>> I've been speaking with a crypto/blockchain publication this week about
>> coming on board to help with their coverage. I will be paid on a per
>> article basis during a one month "trial period," after which, if all goes
>> well, I'll be offered a full-time position.
>>
>> Now, I also write copy for some crypto/blockchain companies at current.
>> One company is a startup in the space, whereas the other is a PR firm that
>> represents other crypto companies (among other subjects).
>>
>> The editor has stated that I need to stop writing for these companies
>> before beginning the trial period. I understand his reasoning (i.e.
>> conflict of interest), but it seems risky.
>>
>> What happens if I cut ties with a chunk of high paying work only to see
>> the full-time staff position get passed on to someone else? I should add
>> that the staff position will likely make up for the loss of marketing work
>> financially, and I have no problem dropping the latter once I've signed a
>> contract to work full-time for this publication.
>>
>> It is indeed tricky, and I thought members of the group would have some
>> good ideas/counter-proposals. What's a win-win for all parties in this
>> situation?
>>
>> Thanks in advance,
>>
>> Liam
>>
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